Gun suggestion: Mortar

Found in military bases, they throw bombs from a considerable distance, they can only be used when fixed to the ground, their advantage is that the player does not need to hold it to use it.

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Does this really have a place in a game that’s centered around survival and occasional base raiding ?
Keep in mind, Unturned II is going in a much more survival direction, unlike whatever kind of Battlefield+Arma+Roblox Unturned 3.0 has become now.

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Being focused on survival does not mean no taking improvements and upgrades to PVP, unturned II will have much more survival and movement mechanics that will give more focus to PVE, but I believe that mortars would be useful against zombies and base defense.

In my opinion, which really made unturned 3.0 become what it is today thanks to many updates in pvp and few in survival mechanics, Yukon is the only map that animals (bears, wolfes) and the cold offer any threat.

@darkySp

I love use the @

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This is better off as a workshop item than being part of the game. Random weaponry (notably artillery) befitting for a war-themed strategy/fps game doesn’t have a place in this game.

No, a mortar is not beneficial for PvP. The gameplay isn’t situated around a battlefield with soldiers and enemy encampments, you’re just exploring abandoned remnants of civilization with undead and other survivors.

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I think it is not so different from the bazooka present in unturned 3.0, but the game is not a Battlefiled V but I still hope to see tanks, as well as other military vehicles, I just think that this type of equipment could be an ally for small groups that will defend their base, Jets, Tanks and other vehicles must be added so that players can always evolve their equipment, obviously I don’t want it to go so far as to add a laser weapon.

@Yarrrr

I love use the @

Because combat even in a war field between groups is part of survival, I want a good balance between PVE and PVP but always giving priority to survival resources.

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Would be cool to use against hordes in base defense. I see no problem with it being since we have tanks and helicopters. I could just see it being really rare like a tank. I mean I want U2 to be about survival with camp fires and Hawkhounds. But something I like about Unturned compared to other survivals is the ability to go from camps and log cabins to compounds and tanks.

Some of my favorite moments in Vanilla have been with tanks and attack copters. As everyone against the idea suggests, this won’t be something people just use in the field, but most likely something people will bring to a base raid or defense. Like this won’t be OP, if balanced similar to tanks.

Unturneds 3.0’s “PVP problem” doesn’t stem from weaponized vehicles. Its the TPA KIT servers that dominate server population and the simple progression system. All survival games now suffer from “THE PVP PROBLEM” people think its only a 3.0 thing. That’s why I am hopeful for more AI focused encounters and survival features to add to the survival experience supported by the open free world pvp. And why Unturned 2 can offer a new breath of fresh air to the old survival build we have seen for years.

I mean no one has ever said helicopters and tanks make 3.0 a pvp shooter sandbox. Its the fact that the survival features have an easy learning curve, and after so many years we have grown tired of 3.0’s scene. Pvp is the one thing that keeps most players going and seems like the only thing to do. But what other survival game besides maybe ARK or CONAN have rich PVE things to do other than Pvp.

Even DayZ which I think has some decent survival features lacks anything else to do besides pvp. I don’t think every feature should be judged solely on how it will be used in Pvp, but how it could be used in Pve. Would be awesome to have a tower on your compound or wall with sandbags surrounding a mortar you could use for base defense against zombies hordes as that has been teased.

One of my favorite base raid defenses was me and two friends in a castle defending against six people with a tank on vanilla. They only had two shells and blew some holes in the base and the battle was glorious. Removing things like militarized vehicles and weapons would be a step in the wrong direction, as they are not the heart of the issue.

If they spawned at every military spawn, along with fully loaded LMG’s yes it would be a problem. But in moderation this would be a fun addition. Very cool to see in base raids too.

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I think its a good idea since that they are fairly ubiquitous, but they should be simplified and easy to use but not overly simplistic, you should be able to fire on a target in a specific area with just over a hill kinda range.

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what about the enemy NPCs? Surely they would have some kind of camps, the mortar could be used effectively for that I guess

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for that and against player bases

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I really dig the idea. For the people that say it doesn’t fit or would be overpowered, unturned also has tanks and fighter jets… I’d say make them use dedicated mortar shells that are really rare to find. I we could have some different shells:
Tear gas, smoke, explosive, fragmentation and maybe makeshift. The explosive shouldn’t be instakill on a fully armored player, just broken bones and smth like 70 dmg. You could also decrease accuracy or add even add wind to nerf it.

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The people that say that mortars don’t fit the theme, also think that Tanks and Jets don’t fit, so what’s your point ?

Plus, we’re talking about Unturned II. That’s going to be a completely new game, it’s not going to have all the things that 3.0 has, such as, you guessed it, fighter jets and tanks. Those things are not on the Trello page and there was no mention of such military technology being present in Unturned II from Devlogs either.
Besides, even if they do get in the game, they’re going to be OP, whatever you do to them.
The concept of a mortar, at its core, is to fire shells over a specific area from long distances and behind cover.

Would you really want to have a mortar shoot your base or some random city that you’re in from behind a hill that you HAVE to climb in order to get to the mortar ? It’s going to be bullshit, even if you make it do 5 damage and the chances of a mortar shell to spawn is 0,01%, the concept of this just doesn’t work for a game, where you need to scavenge for the smallest things.

With Unturned II having a lot more modding support, all these tacticool military playtoys can be handled by the modding community and the server hosts would put these things in whatever type of server wants to have them. People that just want to play a vanilla survival game just don’t want tanks, fighter jets and mortars doing carpet bombs around the map, because that’s not survival anymore.

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So it means that tanks are not going to be present? tanks and jets are fun and should be well balanced with maintenance and availability on the map, and yes i would love to fight someone who has a mortar since i will also have one to protect my base :slightly_smiling_face:

Following this line of reasoning, fighting someone wearing a vest in the beta would also be OP, have you thought? shooting someone who will receive little damage, mortars are not very different from grenades only that they can shoot from a greater distance, and by their mechanics it would give incentive to build bases.

And yes a PVP is part of survival, since players are also a threat if you just want to just survive just play in singleplayer, tanks and jets in unturned II will not be found on every corner of a street, they will be treated in the same way as in 3.0 finding it is difficult and maintaining it too, gasoline, missile, In other words, it requires a well-structured base, is usually only used when one group clashes with another group.

@darkySp

Yes, except their mortar has the footprint of 3m^2, you base would be 10m^2, if it’s a small one. Your base is a much larger target and due to the nature of mortars, your chances of actually defending yourself with a mortar are slim to none.

No. The vest provides resistance, not immunity to damage. You need to aim, shoot and be able to kill the guy with the vest, before he kills you. He has to do the same amount of work as you do, except he has a vest. You can also just shoot him in the back, you’ll still kill him.

A mortar will start blasting your base from a safe distance and behind cover, while you’ll need to exit your base, get yourself in the open, reach the mortar, kill whoever is using it and then return to your base. All he has to do is to deploy it and start shooting in your base’s general direction. And no, mortar shells are not just long-range grenades, they’re high explosive projectiles that fall from the sky, grenades still need a player to go close to the base and throw them. And they don’t bring an incentive to build bases, the incentive of building bases is to keep yourself safe and keep your loot safe. That’s more than enough incentive to build a base, not a single person will think: “Gee, i should build a base to protect me from mortar fire!”

Again, no. I won’t go in single player, because that’s just not the same as playing multiplayer. Come on, that statement was stupid, even you know that playing single player survival is the most boring experience you can have. You’re effectively saying: “If you want to have a nice survival experience, go in singleplayer, because multiplayer will have mortars and jets and tanks and rocket systems.” Yes, i want to have a survival experience, that doesn’t mean that i want to go around and stack myself on food and supplies so i can occasionally shoot zombies in singleplayer. Players add much more depth to the game, even with advanced AI, singleplayer gets boring the moment you get a gun and base. That’s it, you’ve reached the endgame in singleplayer.

Yes, i know Jets and Tanks and Mortars are not going to be common and i know that they’re expensive to maintain, but that’s the point. They’re rare, their ammo is rare and their maintenance is too expensive to be practical. So, you’re actively pushing for such things, which you will be able to afford to use once in a full moon, because of how rare and expensive they are. This will also encourage zergs, because once you have 10+ players in 1 base, looting the entire map at once, you’re bound to find a tank, have enough fuel to drive it and have higher chances to find tank ammunition. At that stage, you’re going to have 8 players raiding you on foot and then a tank that will have 5-10 shots to demolish your base and you’re never going to be able to be on even ground, unless you’re in a zerg of your own, which is even worse for the game.
Look at zerg raids in Rust, they don’t have a tank and they still manage to take down a double or triple honeycombed base in less than an hour with C4, rockets and explosive bullets.
And nobody guarantees that those zerg groups are going to raid other zergs. Most of the time, it’s quite the opposite, zergs attack smaller groups, because it needs less resources and less time to raid a base when they have less people.

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In this logic helicopters should not be added as they allow an aerial bombardment with grenades, what I mean is that yes most of the time unturned you will have a basic survival, collect medicines, basic weapons but it is good to always have something to evolve, a larger base , the best vehicles in this case the best ones would be the military, the focus of the jets and tanks is to be more focused on an armored and super speed transport than just a weapon of war, considering that mortars have a certain ability to explode a part of a base, it means that everything that could potentially end up with a base must be removed, molotovs because of the fire, police battering rams, among others, items in addition I think it is relatively easier to circumvent a mortar, considering that to use the player must be beside him, in addition of needing to adjust the aim and the trajectory of the projectile, or moreover I am almost sure that we will be able to reinforce our base to the point that it can resist certain explosions.
What really caused the decline of Unturned 3.0 was simple and easy survival mechanics, for an average player zombies are more of a “garnish”, in contrast to shallow concert handling and weapon systems.
@darkySp

Still on mortars despite the reach, the trajectory of the projectile is slow, that is, even if you aim and shoot in a group, they will have enough time to leave the field, plus loud noise to warn of danger…

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Ok, it’s clear that my point is not getting across for you, so i’ll just leave it.

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Time stamp 6:49 and 37:16 this is an interview with Nelson himself talking about tanks and military vehicles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dm10RnPfvBc

I am not trying to change your mind that this should be added or you want tanks but its probably going to happen. But like I said above removing militarized vehicles and weapons would be a step backwards. This video is also from a year ago and everything is SUBJECT TO CHANGE, but I don’t see him going back on it.

I am as well excited for more survival themes to make U2 more diverse in game play, compared to just pvp. I also don’t speak for the games direction but its not gonna be another Yukon or Long Dark. Just because a game is labeled survival doesn’t mean it has to be all campground loot, with barely any military. Seems like a lot of people on this forum think survival focus means we will have like 5 shots to our name and a half eaten can of beans as our most prized possessions. I want more progression to military loot through AI enemies and survival features so I can’t just walk into military naked and get a working full auto Heartbreaker. But I don’t want it removed.

I think if this was an issue we would see it present in 3.0, and numbers are numbers more people will usually always have big advantages. On all my hours of vanilla I have never seen a group use a tank to a point where it was overshadowing us and ruining the game. C4 usually is the main go to raid weapon, just cool to spice it up with a tank shell or two. I like it as it adds more of a sandbox element than other survival games.

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Throw grenades up at an angle…

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I do think that all kind of military stuff should be kept for maps where well armed bandits and massive hordes have a huge role, it shouldn’t have it’s place on basic, survival maps tho, for this kind of map, i would draw the limit to lmg, rocket launchers and low caliber mortars, with all the flaws coming with those (e.g : weight, rarity of ammunition, and the fact that owning one is making you a priority target).

i have yet to play a game where a mortar makes sense besides arma in which they can be used to do absolutely stupid things with (like kill 30+ infantry stationed at an outpost).

i think one in unturned has no place, mainly considering balancing issues. pretty much means you can dump explosives rather accurately from a safe distance without exposing yourself to an enemy base or whatever other stationary target. It can’t be easily countered outside of the mortar operator being caught, which seems unlikely in general and definitely won’t happen when its being used to offline raid. nevermind that being under attack by this would be absolutely unfun if you are inside your base - with little to no counterplay, it would be incredibly frustrating just sitting there waiting to be blown up since you know there isn’t much to be done about it.

Even if its ability to damage or destroy structures is borderline removed, it becomes niche and still retains the unfun aspect of it.

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I don’t know…seems a bit weird for unturned.

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