People provide their counter arguments, I provide my own, then they provide the same arguments, then I provide the same and my own.
Its an endless damn cycle. Sure, people showed different reasons occasionally and I tried to address them. Im sorry if it seemed like I was still saying the same thing.
Now on to the rest of your reply
Not really, I would be punished for not planning accordingly.
Heres what I’ll say to the last part
Not only does it make factories viable (Like how nelson mentioned he wanted something like factorio), and as I said before (And I point I forgot to mention in the post) it punishes you for not planning accordingly. Sure, it may take some time and be rather annoying to some people, But if you
accidentally craft something (Such as a gun or vehicle) you have time to cancel it, rather than being screwed over for an accident. It also adds a minimal amount of realism for those who are concerned about it.
Also, you could split the materials among multiple people to craft stuff faster sure, but it actually makes sense, as if you had multiple people working on making something you could make multiple of those often.
For some people (Like myself) it makes the game more interesting, while for others it feels like it ruins the game.
If there are timers, instantly crafting one items doesnt make sense because macros or spam clicking exists. Timers are a good addition. I agree with the points that they waste time, they do if they are implemented incorrectly. Currently you can come into a fight with 10 boxes in your inventory, not giving a shit and spam clicking when you run out of ammo to refil your 2 magazines. If you want and edge in a fight, quickly scrap a military knife and craft a plate in 2 seconds. It doesnt make sense and is laughable.
The point is, Unturned II should make you prepare before going into battles, else you will be at an disadvantage. If you feel you need 3 full magazines fill 3, if you need 10 fill 10. It would be stupid to go with 8 empty magazine and load them up on the field in a split second. Depending on how the buildings work, same thing, but I dont want to comment to much on building since nothing is shown.
I think there should be an animation for example when filling up magazines, that goes relatively quickly, shows the player placing bullets into the magazine at a quick pace, but in return he is unable to do anything and is harmless. If he wanted to, he would have to eather reload his gun if thats he magazine he was filling up, or store/drop the magazine before pulling his weapon out again.
I’m late to the discussion, but I strongly disagree against the addition of crafting timers (and would have voted against the suggestion in the poll, but there doesn’t seem to be an option for that other than “I have no rationale”)
As the others have brought up, I could easily spam click to circumvent this. Plus, it should really be the other way around - making bulk quantities of items should be more efficient per unit time for each item. That’s also how batch production works IRL so…
This is an outdated assumption from U3. Building in UII will utilize a central building tool as opposed to individual tedious parts. (Think Rust.)
This is also another outdated assumption - as we’ve already seen in the Firing Range demo, magazine attachments will be refilled with ammunition directly from the ammunition item itself - no crafting is technically involved. Similar to EFT.
I’d support magloading taking some actual time though, and it would also warrant the addition of speed loaders and stripper clips proper!
Okay at this point I know you were just trying to think of more ideas, but I’d really like to instead see Project Zomboid’s system of having individual component maintenance as opposed to a central HP pool where condition of parts is nonexistent. It’d also make upkeeping a vehicle much more work and resource intensive, and open up avenues of salvaging or even bringing back to life derelict vehicles in the game world.
As for the issues of mid-combat crafting, you could directly alleviate each issue rather than utilizing a blanket solution to each mechanic.
refilling magazine attachments during combat would take a reasonable amount of time, but still be possible to do, especially with speedloaders (which themselves are reusable and have to be reloaded for future use).
I don’t think crafting medical items should even be possible. At most you should be able to cobble together a crude rag or douse it in some antiseptic, not tear up a hoodie and immediately have a hospital-grade dressing like in U3.
Building is already seeing huge changes. There’s plenty of room here for other solutions that more directly address realism and balance during combat - such as having the construction of the buildable itself require the player’s time and effort instead of a single click (e.g. The Forest, early versions of Rust, hell even Fortnite tries to do this with very basic building timers)
With that said, here’s my breakdown of advantages and disadvantages with crafting timers - based on my experience playing survival games both with and without them in the past.
Advantages
Very blatantly attempts to prevent exploitative actions to gain unfair advantages during combat, assuming you have not crafted it prior
Can be seen as immersive
Disadvantages
Most of the time, slapping timers on everything is genuinely irritating and gives the entire game a grindy feel as if you’re upgrading defenses in Clash of Clans or doing something equally tedious
Still not hard to exploit
Often used as a substitute for the lack of actually realistic game mechanics such as magazine refilling
Discourages crafting complex items and increasingly encourages killing people or raiding/looting to get what you want
In games with crafting/building timers, you can still very much fight while doing so. I have yet to see a game with these that doesn’t have this issue - in Rust people still craft meds, ammunition, even weapons such as spears to throw, mid-combat. I have seen ideas in these games such as forced crafting interrupt during combat, or having crafting timers only when combat is detected, but no game has implemented this effectively to my knowledge
I will admit, I was slightly salty about something at the time of making this post
Its not bulking items, you enter in an amount, (or click a button) (Like 7 days to die) and each arrow adds on to the crafting time. Those examples were bad because for 1- I didnt add up the time it would take for each.
So basically, spam clicking would just add arrows to the crafting qenue rather that doing them instantly. By instant, I mean ti feels instant, btu its more like .5 seconds
I was using the best example I had at the time being
Ye
Yes… YES
Kinda the idea xd,
as pointed above, I didnt use addition and thats why it seems like a macro would craft quicker.
not necessarily, but I see where you’re coming from
7 days to die (As Ive mentioned a lot) makes it so each item takes a certain amount of time to craft. Thats kinda what Im going for witht his post.
In 7 days to die, you can craft 2-3 arrows per second while doing anything you want, but at the same time, you cant increase or decrease that speed. (With or without Macros)
Most of the arguements against this probably come from poor communication on my part, which makes This V
Not actually true.
Sorry for the miscommunication on my part, Ill try to do it better in the future.
(Side note: this post was thrown together in about 5 minutes, so that may be where most of the problems come from)
Rust has an identical system in that crafting timers are fixed per item. However, this still doesn’t really do anything against macros as legit players can craft large amounts of items just as quickly anyways. Macros generally are a far more substantial problem with regards to firing semi and burst weaponry across all survival games than they are for crafting. In other words, there’s no need to try coming up with a solution for a problem that basically doesn’t exist.
However, in Rust, there are also different tiers of workbenches, and they not only provide tiers of crafting (similarly to U3), but if you are in the vicinity of a workbench that is a higher tier than what is necessary for you to craft with, it contributes a speed multiplier to the craft times themselves as long as you stay near the workbench as you craft. I’m not suggesting UII use this system since static crafting tiers are a bit redundant in terms of overall game flow (as literally anybody who’s grinded Crafting skill in U3 can testify), but I do feel like Rust has handled it better than 7D2D’s workbench queues (although 7D2D took a slightly Factorio-esque approach by having their workbench be an automated queue in itself, with an input and an output).
I would blindly say that this is a good idea for balancing if it wasn’t for the fact that, U3 didn’t need this kind of system, so why should U4?
Doesn’t change much. Doesn’t really feel in style with unturned either.
U3 was a blind pvp fest where you could empty all your ammo into someones general direction, and then instantly refill all of your ammo with an ammo crate and surprise the guy running up thinking you have no ammo
Also, yes, I did change my pfp to the scout. deal with it
i don’t think refilling a magazine should even be a crafting recipe, but i was talking about stuff like making building parts (like you mentioned in the original post)
in nelsons trello he mentions that he wants to have crafting stations like a table saw and other things, thats what im talking about
This has never happened before. No one is THAT bad to waste all their magazines. What would they even be shooting? The sky? People only miss that much to make a dramatic cutscene for there curated map. Also, no one who is smart runs out in the open because they think “oh, hes out of ammo.”
I like the idea of items taking time to craft, this could for example make raiding harder becaouse you cant just instantly craft more raiding gear when you find more materials inside the base you are raiding
