Personally, I don’t think being biased against hateful conduct is a bad thing, but hey, that’s just my opinion.
3 Likes
because i disagree
being biased against hatred is a good thing personally
4 Likes
I personally believe that, to better identify dogwhistling, staff be added that are able to actually identify such things (lgbtq people see it every day and are thus much better at spotting it it). The current unturned official staff seem incapable of identifying it, and when they do, they barely take any appropriate responses besides outright banning the worst of offenders. A moderation staff focused on combatting bigotry needs to apply mutes, kicks and bans to ALL of these offenders, not just banning the ones who directly are revealed to be bigots by their words alone. NONE of the moderators on the unturned official discord seem capable of even REMOTELY understanding dogwhistles, and seem incapable of understanding even the most basic of context clues in regards to these matters. Hell, there was an edit of flodo’s trans flag post with a Soviet flag with the words (in Russian) “For Stalin!” posted and Genestic didn’t see any possible political overtones with support of Stalin. To actually ID these dogwhistles, it seems like it would be important to have somebody “biased against bigotry”, as Genestic put it, to actually be able to understand what these posts are saying (they don’t outright state their bigotry).
6 Likes
gen, im gonna put this simply, i was gonna say this earlier but 15min slowmode
put simply (and also like what romelete said) we are lgbtq people, we are part of minority groups. for the most part, the staff team is not. the staff team cannot identify bigotry on a level we can.
im “biased against bigotry” because i want to LIVE, and dont support people who support arguments that directly contradict the simple idea that we EXIST. especially as you saw the thread under flodo’s art as a “clusterfuck” of people arguing over “pointless things” when these “pointless” things were the mere existance of LGBTQ people.
we cant just make a poll that says “are you a bigot” then ban those who put yes, we have to ween them out, as you did not understand.
5 Likes
“I don’t like when people assault me or my friends, but hey, I don’t wanna be biased against assault”
8 Likes
As I said on Discord, I appreciate your intentions. Banning bigots is a good thing, and it is in the server rules. I’d like to mention that the staff team has been internally discussing dog-whistling, and I admit I am new to the term as of now. We have already begun moderating members for it.
I posted the message that I did because I am concerned with incorrectly banning people when enforcing this policy. However, I do not have a final say on who becomes a moderator - that is a team decision. If you wish to apply, you are free to do so. If you felt that I was telling you not to do so, I apologize.
2 Likes
In addition it’s an insult that all Postman got for his disgusting behaviour is a 20 minute mute is an insult and proves the point that the community is rotten to the core and that the staff team is incapable of doing their job correctly even more.
Also this screenshot is just the tip of the iceberg.
7 Likes
Yeah cause postman is the pinnacle of good takes
6 Likes
I genuinely believe that the Moderation team needs more queer people on it, So much fly’s under the radar if you don’t have the proper experience to identity forms of hate. Random example but, A cis person should not be chosen over a trans person when it comes to the job of identifying what is and isn’t transphobia. The amount of stuff that gets to slide on by because of the lack of willingness to put a foot down on the issue is really upsetting.
I wholeheartedly agree with this, this is one of the points I attempted to educate on in my original post. Nowadays not all the bigotry is gonna be easy to catch in-your-face language. This is something a Moderator needs to understand to do their job or it would be best for them to leave the job to someone else.
I am genuinely hoping that I am missing something from the Postman side of things cause from what I’ve seen far more than a mute is warranted. It doesn’t inspire much confidence in me on the current handling due to temp bans being the previous go-to on handling clear problem people.
“all bias is bad” is the exact kind of neutral stance we are attempting to convey the harm of. To quote myself in the original post:
Being bias’d against bigotry is literally what you should be by default, there is no world where you should look at a statement of clear hatred and think “Let’s hear em out!” I understand applying this to situations where a misunderstanding may be the cause of the problem but 9 out of 10 cases its been intentional.
I am honestly fairly disappointed cause from what I’ve seen in this thread and the discord screenshots Genestic is wholly unable to wrap their head around how this works. “Do you not see the irony in ‘inviting’ people to send transphobic messages if that’s what you’re against in the first place” shows a complete lack of, dare I say, empathy? It sounds to me that Gen is fine with the bigots being around if they just keep their mouth shut. Which doesn’t fix the issue at all cause there are still bigots in the room! I don’t wish to assume the worst so clarification on this would be nice.
I appreciate the internal discussions being held but this is not a problem that is just gonna fix itself with the methods/philosophy the team has previously used. Cause as we’ve seen the past couple years it doesn’t work.
6 Likes
Only gonna reply to the first part of this, because I myself am queer. The only problem with your suggestion of having a queer person decide what’s punishable or not instead of a cis person is that makes the staff have to wait for said person to give advice on the subject, and their thoughts, and in that time the subject could get much worse and we usually dont like having to wait on others words to decide how we moderate.
3 Likes
Very fair point, I don’t really have much to contest it other than my original statement. I still believe more Queer moderators would be ideal.
2 Likes
I mean rulings can be changed, no? If swift action must be taken then it can always be re-evaluated later, no?
2 Likes
With the way that the staff team works, after the initial decision is made by a moderator, if they moderator thinks their punishment is correct and another staff member wishes to have it changed, the process we go through usually takes days if not weeks to complete. This in turn could result in people having the wrong punishment given to them for that amount of time. And during that time, people could complain about that punishment, or do what they did thinking it was okay. Essentially causing a popcorn effect.
4 Likes
Thanks for the clarification. Is this a official server mandate by discord or just how things have been historically run, if so this seems really weird and inefficient. If more investigation must be done and action must be swift then wouldn’t a mute with a follow up ban if investigation warrants it be more efficient?
Infractions are pretty much always punished instantly (or the moment they get reported and vetted anyway). The process Vex describes can get started after, when a user or a fellow mod disagrees with the punishment rendered.
Not mandated by Discord as far as I am aware.
1 Like
The user who posted that got banned and his posts deleted, but it goes to show how intolerant a large part of the community is, and it really poses a risk as many childrens are in here.
Showcase is being mis-used and since it is likely the most seen channel, I think there should be a temporary restriction on who can post there until this cool down, so that only persons who behave may post here.
I gotta thanks Andiq for banning him quickly.
7 Likes
I hope that this issue within the community gets properly dealt with. I’ve personally lost count of how many times I’ve been sent death threats for simply existing in-game as a trans girl, and having a small group of people harass me for a year after coming out was hellish to deal with. This issue has made the game nearly unplayable for me without completely disabling text, vc, player names, and signs/flags. All I can hope is that this issue within the community begins to get solved.
12 Likes
still open, they’re free to post if they want to
1 Like
Wanted to check: is this in reference to more feedback from affected players, or to SDG?
Molt and I were actually talking about this post again just this morning. We’re of course open to further suggestions/proposals of what can/should be changed.
2 Likes
calling people slurs in UO does constitute a vile and toxic community 
Regardless of if Nick has–which I would wager they’ve probably have–it’s ultimately irrelevant that older games that do not receive active support are toxic when we’re talking about a game that does get active support from a developer that has made it clear that they want to foster a positive community.
It should be added if possible methinks. Steam’s filter should probably be turned on by default since the majority of people don’t like seeing profanity blasted at them all the time.
ok?
3 Likes