First off p2w is a good way to get servers money, but now it’s abused way too much by certain people we all know and “love” COUGH. But the specific buying items and not get a whole kit is stupid and should be banned. So a child with his mommy’s roblox credit card cold spend 3k buying money, or specific items. Only for them to be wiped the next month and getting a spanking for wasting $3,000.
It’s simply wrong to steal money from kids, I’m not very good at speeches or much less making convincing arguments but I feel like im partially expressing what everyone feels.
I just made a new account to post this cuz im a lazy shit that was too lazy to login
I for one think this would be a great idea. mainly for one reason say someone plays on one of the p2w servers for hours on end. Then a guy $20 could just get double that progress in a minute. To me, that doesn’t seem very fair.
“These servers are already so large that removing them from the master server list does absolutely nothing, they don’t need it to survive. You would be naive thinking that they do need it to survive. They survive and thrive through there existing playerbase.”
Except, no, actually. Even though most of the big P2W servers do have a inner, dedicated community, these are very often extremely small, and the vast majority of players are just people who find the servers through youtube videos, or just because they’re at the top of the server list in the in-game Unturned browser. I personally do not agree with Rain’s very extreme take on the matter of just banning ALL type of purchases altogether, but saying that this wouldn’t work is simply untrue.
I see a lot of replies that specify “ban p2w” but aren’t understanding the point of this RFC.
The RFC is a discussion, not a poll. Please provide opinions or facts to backup your claims.
This discussion is directed towards tangible, one time purchases and not P2W as a whole. Many comments here are not understanding that.
Well Yeah, Donating is contributing to the server. Why do you think Youtubers say the names of their Pateron supporters, Why do you think you think PBS says “and viewers like you”. They legit donated money to the server, they at least deserve something as a sign of recognition. It’s a courtesy.
Its not scummy, it would be scummy if they outright dissed players that didn’t donate.
In the case of Modern, he isn’t doing anything unfair at all. Players have everything they need. You don’t HAVE to buy a rank, because it just gives you little things.
Aren’t corporations that run services doing the same, as-well as Youtubers that start their own streaming services? I mean you said your self.
If Nobody cares about the tiny changes, then it isn’t a P2W server. The only reason why people would buy a rank is because they actually like the server that they’re RPing on and donate to it, as you said yourself, the benefits are minuscule. Most players that donate on his server stick around for a long time. The goal of Nelsons post was to prevent and stop predatory practices. What Modern is doing is not predatory, nor is it scummy. It doesn’t even fit into the RFC that Nelson has listed. You’re just throwing accusations in attempt to cause trouble, and to push your Neo anti-capitalist agenda onto a forum for a game what’s essentially made up of kids. At the end of the day, what Modern does not really pertain to this argument. He hasn’t broken any of Nelson’s guidelines, and it just seems absolutely petty to bring it up.
If you have a personal vendetta against the guy, I don’t think this is the place to bring it up. Cough Zman Cough
Anyway, to add onto this, most services, and even credit card companies have an age gate. I bet most of them use their parents credit card to buy stuff, so shouldn’t be on the parent for not moderating what they are doing?
me when waiting a while hour to continue dunking on people
ah I see why you’re defending so hard. mmm. yes. makes sense now.
yes leave it to mr bossman.
I never said he should block LAN IPv4’s, that’s the point? Block the entire IP address.
If the IP address is associated with multiple servers (because scummy gameserver rent services simply rent a VPS and resell at a higher price, as you have clearly explained) then, even better, it should be the gameserver renters job to enforce the EULA, as they are the hosters of the server, even if they are not the technical owner of the server.
It would become your responsibility to make sure your ‘clients’ are not blatantly breaking the TOS when using your ‘service’.
win-win for everyone. We get a proper serverlist, and you do your responsibility of keeping your clients in check.
Of course, there could be much more elaborate ways of doing this. Say, if it is a rented service, then each client has a UUID that is sent to the serverlist, whereby we can blacklist it the UUID if and when it violates TOS.
In theory, this should work just fine. The ‘clients’ would be given no access to delete or replace the UUID (as set by the service provider) so then the rent service does not have to engage in regular moderation of their clients. That would be a win for the Unturned community, and a win for Rent Services.
So for rented servers, the solution is UUID’s generated and given by the renter that can be banned. For typical servers, the solution is IP ban. Any inconsistencies?
Tons of people are flocking here, taking the time to make new accounts, to support banning P2W. Just because what Nelson is suggesting is too weak doesn’t mean people can’t come and say what they really want to see. They want unfair advantages gone, the Unturned community is making their stance very clear.
giving donators recognition =/= giving them priority at the detriment of everyone else
I don’t have to buy a rank on a notoriously P2W server, you’re correct. That doesn’t stop the server from being notoriously P2W.
To clarify I care a lot, I am just conceding these miniscule advantages as something 99.9% of people won’t notice as an unfair advantage, for the sake of keeping the arguments simple and straightforward.
It is both. Making unnecessary paywalls on purpose to generate profit is a scummy practice. Anyone could make a server identical to Modern Mo’s without the paywall. There is nothing special there.
aye, don’t get political mate. Nobody asked and nobody here wants to hear politics.
As much as we disagree, this hits the nail on the head. I am “okay” with most P2W elements. I won’t play on servers like that, but I can understand why they exist. If your preferential treatment gets that blatant to, yeah you kinda deserve to get shat on.
Glass house with a giant bag of stones.
Gonna be kinda hard, but the math checks out. That is not factoring in manhours, but nobody in here is.
While I am inclined to agree they are certainly intertwined, sometimes more closely than you’d like.
So what other companies do with their “free trial, you can upgrade however” business model is scummy?
Modern already gives the players he has a lot, so its necessary to have a paywall. It’s the players choice at the end of the day. Most people that play his server are Unranked because it isn’t holding them back for what the point of the server is, roleplay. Using Modern’s server is a terrible example here. People who buy ranks, do it because they enjoy the server. Not to mention, the only things you get when you donate that somewhat affect your status on the server are, a colored name with a title, and you place higher on the discord list, there’s also official groups for MVP+.
As a wise Khakers once told me, don’t be throwing stones in glass houses.
I was talking about your stance on all purchases with in game rewards that aren’t purely cosmetical. While I would like to see any and all transactions with rewards gone too, implementing such a drastic change right now really does not make much sense.
Most people that play his server are Unranked because it isn’t holding them back for what the point of the server is, roleplay.
Who the hell do you think you’re fooling? I used to play on the server not even half a year ago and it was absolutely garbage - there was no RP, all you could do to have fun was mess around with your friends, which is why I think most people play Unturned Roleplay to begin with.
I think it’s ok to have a way to support a server.
In the end they have to pay every month server (or even electrical) bills to keep the server running.
I also think giving a direct advantage that is unavailable to a non-paying player or a kit with unobtainable weapons to a player that payed 100 dollars is unfair, but small perks like 20% cheaper prices at vendors or slightly larger vault spaces are ok.
It isn’t strange that you would defend business interests at the detriment of the community. However, I could care less about the renting subject, as it is irrelevent and it was a one-time poke at you. I am interested in P2W.
this has nothing to do with my solution to P2W servers. irrelevant and off-topic.
I ran my franchise without paying for staff, or getting any “licenses” because I am not a business, I am a benefit to the Unturned community and I am apart of it - I was a server hoster. Not something to profit off of it.
sure. irony.
Well then it will be the hosting companies problem to deal with, when their IP gets blacklisted. good job!
Or, they could take responsbility and moderate their clients.
OR, as I elaborately suggested, the win-win compromise is that “hosting companies” are given UUID’s that they assign to each client server, thus the responsibility falls back into SDG staff’s hands without the collateral damage of blacklisting your entire “hosting company” from the master serverlist.
no comment
It isnt “political” if it is “mainstream” amirite. haha lol, politics bad I would never engage in pooooolitics.
If it were my decision, Unturned as a product is not something that people can take and turn into a “free trial” at the expense of the developer - or atleast, it shouldn’t be.
Just because a server provides lots of content, doesn’t mean that it has to paywall future or existing content. You just makes claims IE “so its necessary” without explaining what makes it necessary.
I added lots of content to my servers and my roleplays endlessly, without donations, without P2W, without paywalls. There was no “necessity to have a paywall” as you claim. I am walking talking counter-evidence to your claim.
Can you prove this?
Or do people do it to get an unfair advantage?
It doesn’t quite matter what server people are getting a paid unfair advantage on, or what their reason behind it is, the point is that they are getting a paid unfair advantage. You’re trying to skirt around the problem by bringing up irrelevant GOTCHA points that do not contribute to the problem at hand.
People can buy a rank that does not put them at a competitive advantage, because they enjoy the server and want to support it monetarily. But you claim that people buy unfair advantages because they enjoy the server. Your logic does not hold.
If people wanted to support the server no matter if they will, or will not, get an unfair advantage, then you’re essentially arguing that if we removed P2W from servers, players would donate their money at the same rate as if it were a P2W purchase.
In that case, P2W server franchises should have no problem supporting these simple ideas!
It makes sense to make the game fun and fair for everyone. Its an open world survival game, not a marketplace for children to pay their way to the top.
If you can not understand why removing paid competitive advantages from the game makes sense, then what are you thinking?
I agree! Players can support their favorite servers monetarily without getting paid competitive advantages in return!
This implies that, people who pay, will essentially get 20% more money to spend on in-game items, which, is indirectly just paying for in-game currency, which can be used to buy an unfair advantage.
This is a compromise I can suffice. Its unfair, but its something I personally do not care about.
Based!
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The one-hour timer between posts is annoying, so let me recap everything that has been said, @danaby2
TL;DR
Nelson supports blacklisting servers that sell one-time one-item things. Like buying an APC one time for 1$
Everyone agrees with this, but a majority of the Unturned community thinks it is lackluster, and insufficient to fixing the overall problem of pay to win servers.
Countless people are flooding the SDG forums with new accounts they’ve made just so they can announce their support for ending pay to win servers. Something I have never ever seen before on another other post, for any other cause.
The only people in this thread seriously defending pay to win practices are some folks from Modern Roleplay, and a lot of their points were easily debunked (such as the myth that hosting servers costs gazillions of dollars)
Can I prove this? I mean I don’t think you understand but, there’s no winners in creative roleplay. People who donated do have only a slight advantage. Again, none of this fits into Nelsons RFC. He isn’t doing anything wrong. So I don’t see why you have to argue in a RFC about something thats completely unrelated to the issue at hand. We are going off topic.
I think P2W servers that give heavily unfair advantages are bad. However, Moderns server does not do this. It provides a small marginal advantage.
No matter how well constructed your post is, Nelson is being drifted by individuals, who has 0 good or honest intentions for community, but just wants to release their anger towards others.
I do not condone p2w practices that impacts the performance, and competitive-fun factor of the game. microtransactions in general are fine if they are single player experience games. But the moment you introduce microtransactions that gives p2w advantages into a multiplayer game it automatically ruins the credibility of competition.
You can argue that some cash cow games like maplestory, or genshin impact are doing well. sure I would believe you for those niches. but the majority of games that have been tainted by some sort of loot box for advantage or microtransactions for advantaged games ruined their rep for competitive play and fairness. Halo, call of duties, runescape, a lot of EA games…, plants vs zombies.
That’s a whole thing in itself… but the fact these guys have to milk the player base to be able to run a dedicated server, or their own server. Is a setup that promotes, and encourages more predatory behaviors to the poor bastards that want a good experience in the server. That fact doesn’t jive well with me. I tried running a server myself and found that my server ended up being a fish in a wide ocean of p2w crap, and I just ended up shutting it down because there was no point in running a server when all these other flashy but really shtty servers overshadow what you have, or your attempts to make a experience good for people.
Hello there, Mr. Nelson of the sex, I like your fantastic idea and take big action furthermore I’ll like to take a quote from the bible. “Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful.”
If you don’t agree with Nelson of the sex you are going against the mighty God himself
well, i believe price comes with equal feature…
no comment